Hey all,
After reading through the discussion on the mouse guns I had a question on ammo for the 380.
I picked up a P3AT from a friend who needed the cash and not having owned one I am unsure on how to judge which ammo would be best for carry.
I know I need to train with it more than my main carry(G19)to become proficient with it.
SO how do you judge ammo to be the best for carry other than reliability in the specific weapon?
Thanks
Personal Defense Network Forum » Handguns
If you have to carry a .380, which ammo.
(10 posts)-
# Posted 5 months ago
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Whatever the gun will feed & extract - sometimes an issue with the P3AT.
Personally, I prefer penetration over expansion in the underpowered .380; if the bullet doesn't get to anything important, who cares how much it expands?
Given that preference, I'd pick the Hornady XTP first, the Remington Golden Sabre second, and the CorBon DPX third.
Start at the top and stop when you find one your gun likes.
-=[ Grant ]=-
-=[ Grant ]=-
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Gunsmith, Trainer, Writer
Combat Focus Shooting (tm) Instructor
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http://www.grantcunningham.com# Posted 5 months ago -
I agree with Grant. I'd look for penetration as well since you are already dealing with a cartridge that doesn't have a whole lot of "oomph" from the get go. I'll also confirm that the P3AT can be pretty finicky about the ammo it likes to eat. The one we have can even be picky about the FMJ ammo it likes to feed sometimes.
Chris S.
NRA Certified Pistol, PPITH, & PPOTH Instructor
NRA Certified RSO
Missouri CCW Instructor# Posted 5 months ago -
Thanks for all the replies! I was thinking of FMJ for the penetration and will definitely look into those you mentioned Grant.
What about all those specialty ammo manufacturers like Buffalo Bore, Double Tap, etc?
If penetration is based on numerous factors such as FPS, bullet weight, and whatever others, how do you choose weight. This is something I always wondered but never ask as to not sound dumb. I always carried whatever seem to be what everyone else was leaning to.# Posted 5 months ago -
Cshoff, what does your P3AT like?
Ordnancecorp, from the testing I've seen the XTP has penetration similar to FMJ, but will expand to a blunt face (perhaps a little more) while doing so. In my estimation, it would be the best of both worlds.
The others I mentioned have slightly more expansion and less penetration. For any given caliber, the heavier bullet will generally produce greater penetration.
Personally, I stick with major makers; boutique ammo manufacturers have a habit of going out of business with boring regularity. I also question a tiny company's ability to maintain the research resources necessary to produce top-drawer products. That doesn't mean they can't, of course, but I'd rather take my chances with a company that has a long track record.
-=[ Grant ]=-
-=[ Grant ]=-
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Gunsmith, Trainer, Writer
Combat Focus Shooting (tm) Instructor
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http://www.grantcunningham.com# Posted 5 months ago -
Grant - I have found that it likes the Magtech FMJ ammo the best. Don't know if they use a slightly harder jacket or what, but it seems to operate pretty good with it. It had hiccups with Fiochi and Winchester USA FMJ ammo. I've honestly never even fired a hollow point through it as we have only used it for training purposes and as a prop in the classroom.
Chris S.
NRA Certified Pistol, PPITH, & PPOTH Instructor
NRA Certified RSO
Missouri CCW Instructor# Posted 5 months ago -
Wow. You know a gun's finicky when it refuses to run any ball ammo!
-=[ Grant ]=-
-=[ Grant ]=-
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Gunsmith, Trainer, Writer
Combat Focus Shooting (tm) Instructor
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http://www.grantcunningham.com# Posted 5 months ago -
It's not that it "refused", it just had a Fail To Feed every now and then. At first, I figured it was a magazine problem, but it doesn't seem to do it with the Magtech ammo, and I can't find anything wrong with either of the mags. This same gun also had a defective extractor on it when we first got it. It would FTE about every 3rd or 4th round.
Now having said that about the particular P3AT we own, I have heard from others that their P3AT's run real good for them.
Chris S.
NRA Certified Pistol, PPITH, & PPOTH Instructor
NRA Certified RSO
Missouri CCW Instructor# Posted 5 months ago -
Well then It looks like I need to buy a bunch of ammo and see. The friend I got it from is a Riflesmith and said it has never had a failure. Of course I didn't ask him what it likes!
"For any given caliber, the heavier bullet will generally produce greater penetration"
I figured as much but why the trend towards lighter and faster instead of heavier and faster? If you look at 9mm it seems to be(at least to me) that 115gr is the standard in defense ammo...why not 147gr at 1100fps? I am not a reloader and this might be an obvious answer?# Posted 5 months ago -
The trend to lighter and faster has actually waned a bit. A decade or so ago, there was fierce rivalry between the "light and fast" and "heavy and slow" camps, with some extremely light (65gn @2000 fps!) boutique 9mm loads being sold. This was the heyday of Magsafe and Glaser and the infamous "Strasbourg Goat Tests." Seemingly endless magazine articles talked about "energy dump" as the most important factor in handgun performance, despite the fact that there is no such thing (energy isn't dumped, it's used to do work. Sometimes it's useless work, but that's another topic.)
In the ensuing years we've learned that there has to be a balance in bullet performance: the bullet has to penetrate enough to reach something important, and it has to be constructed in such a way as to do rapid and significant damage when it gets there (generally meaning it must expand.)
More penetration is not only inefficient, it's also dangerous to things behind the target; early, violent expansion is a waste of potential. The operative term became "controlled expansion", and that's where we sit today.
Ammunition choice is always a compromise. In the .380, as we've discussed, the problem is lack of penetration to reach vitals. In the 9mm, excessive penetration is actually a problem, which is why the lighter bullets are more popular. The 147gn subsonic loads, which satisfied the "heavy and slow" camp, had a tendency to shoot through the target and not expand. Once they were sped up a bit, they became much more useful - increased expansion countered the excessive penetration.
One the other hand, the 115gn loads sometimes showed less-than-ideal penetration, which is why the 124gn class came into being. Today, those police agencies issuing 9mm usually prefer a 124gn +P or 147gn load for balanced overall performance.
-=[ Grant ]=-
-=[ Grant ]=-
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Gunsmith, Trainer, Writer
Combat Focus Shooting (tm) Instructor
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http://www.grantcunningham.com# Posted 5 months ago
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