Rob Leatham

Worlds Collide: Stage vs. Simulation

Rob Leatham
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Duration:   6  mins

Worlds Collide is an ongoing video series that brings together the perspectives of two of the shooting world’s top minds: PDN’s own Rob Pincus and renowned competition shooter Rob Leatham of Team Springfield™. What can defensive and competition shooters learn from each other?


With two targets set up at the range, Rob Leatham explains that for competitors, these could be used as a stage or for a training drill. He then performs a complex competition-inspired drill combining elements of both IDPA and USPSA and explains the reasoning for it, while Rob Pincus shakes his head incredulously.

Leatham explains that these shooting drills are a test of skill: of drawing, accuracy, speed, target acquisition, and reloading. Pincus clarifies that this is a stage of a competition, not a simulation of a gunfight.

Defensive Shooting

Pincus explains to Leatham how these two targets can be used to simulate a multiple target engagement for defensive handgun training. He has Leatham call out commands related to the two targets so that Pincus has to process the information and act accordingly.

After numerous rounds downrange, Pincus explains how application of shooting skills occurred in this defensive scenario.


Leatham debunks the idea that drills teach someone how to shoot better. A drill is a tool that a shooter uses to test a skill such as speed or accuracy, and the drill should be done repeatedly with the goal of seeing continual improvement. Pincus, however, disapproves of the importance of rules in the competition arena, as they do not reflect the unpredictability of defensive shooting encounters.

Both Robs agree that this is an area in which competitive and defensive shooting differ greatly.

More videos in the Worlds Collide series can be found on Springfield Armory’s site, and look for others here on PDN soon.

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One Response to “Worlds Collide: Stage vs. Simulation”

  1. Tim

    This would predicate that both assailants are armed. Guy 1 is always the one with the weapon; shoot him first. Guy 2 may turn and run, therefore you can't shoot him. His threat is eliminated. No matter how quick you are, autopsy will show his orientation when you fired.

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